The Brain It On! Podcast
Your brain is the powerhouse behind your life, your relationships, and your ability to overcome challenges. On The Brain It On! Podcast, we explore practical ways to nurture your brain for optimal health and happiness. We delve into strategies to strengthen your connections with loved ones, build resilience, and navigate life's ups and downs with a focus on brain health. This podcast offers actionable tips, emotional regulation techniques, and a trauma-informed approach to help you thrive in all areas of life. Discover how understanding and caring for your brain can transform your relationships and empower you to face any challenge with confidence.
The Brain It On! Podcast
Reframing Pain: How to Help Your Brain Cope With Discomfort
In this episode, we explore the profound impact of language on our healing journey. By shifting our focus from "pain" to "discomfort," we can rewire our brains and empower ourselves to manage physical challenges more effectively. We delve into the science of psychoneuroimmunology, examining how our thoughts and emotions influence our physical health.
Key Takeaways:
- The Power of Language: We discuss how changing the way we talk about pain can alter our perception and response to discomfort.
- The Science of Healing: We explore the intricate connection between our minds and bodies, highlighting the role of the nervous system and immune system in the healing process.
- Practical Strategies for Managing Discomfort: We offer practical tips and techniques, such as mindfulness, breathing exercises, and self-compassion, to help you navigate discomfort with greater ease.
- The Importance of Patient-Centered Care: We emphasize the need for healthcare providers to listen to patients' experiences and tailor treatment plans to individual needs.
- Reframing Pain for Children: We share strategies for helping children understand and manage discomfort in a compassionate and age-appropriate way.
Additional Resources:
- Download the "Coping with Discomfort" resource
- Check out our breathing videos for kids
- Listen to The PAWsitive Choices Podcast
Call to Action:
- Share this episode with someone who may benefit from a new perspective on pain.
- Practice mindfulness and self-compassion daily.
- Follow us on instagram for more resources and behind-the-scenes pictures and videos.
By reframing our understanding of pain, we can unlock our innate healing potential and live a more fulfilling life.
Your brain is the powerhouse behind your life. On this podcast, we explore strategies to strengthen your connections, build resilience and navigate life's ups and downs, with a focus on brain health.
Speaker 2:Discover how understanding and caring for your brain can transform your relationships and empower you to face any challenge with confidence.
Speaker 1:Get ready to brain it on. Empower you to face any challenge with confidence. Get ready to Brain it On. I'm Lindsay, a university instructor of human development and education.
Speaker 2:And I'm Thomas, a registered nurse.
Speaker 1:And welcome to Brain it On. In this episode we explore the role that pain plays in the healing process. We learn what the science says about ways people interpret pain and discuss practical things that you can do to help your brain cope with discomfort. Hey everybody, thanks so much for joining us today.
Speaker 2:Welcome.
Speaker 1:We are excited to have this next episode, episode three of the Positive Choices podcast. Wow, I meant to say burn it on podcast, but actually it's rather appropriate.
Speaker 2:Yes, that was a very appropriate slip because it is a replay of a Positive Choices podcast.
Speaker 1:That's correct. We have another podcast, as we mentioned before, and it's one that we finished recording. Our last episode was in 2022. And so we're actually going to play an episode that we recorded in 2021. And this is one that we did about pain in your body. I had had a couple surgeries, and so it was appropriate at the time in my context, and now that we are walking through Thomas's health journey, it has come up once again really organically in our lives. So let's transition to your health highlight for the week health highlights as you can tell, we have some fun new sounds we.
Speaker 2:We just discovered that our, our new mixing board has sound effects in it, so you might have to bear with us as we just decide to play with them because, um, it's fun for us we really enjoyed using the sound effects before we started recording today. Yeah, I don't think anyone uses them like that anymore, but I think it's enjoyable and you know it's fun, perhaps at your expense, dear listener. We just need things to do, but it's a sacrifice we're willing to make.
Speaker 1:Yes, you know, we just need things to keep ourselves entertained here at the hospital, which is where we're recording from. And this morning Thomas had his doctor come in and the new health team for this week and they talked about kind of this next phase of his health journey. So he started with his bone marrow transplant that was three days ago, which was successful. Thank you so much for everyone's thoughts and support and prayers. He had a successful transplant which was awesome, great success, great success.
Speaker 1:There weren't any big you know reactions at the time no allergic reactions. However, he does have to keep doing chemotherapy to prevent something called graft-first-host disease. So his doctor today talked about the fact that because of this chemotherapy treatment, he's going to start to experience more pain.
Speaker 2:I found a button for that too. Excellent, excellent Smithers.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, right now I'm at what's called my nadir, which means I'm basically bottoming out, called my nadir, which means I'm basically bottoming out, um, hematologically, with a lot of different types of blood cells and such uh, namely neutrophils. But, um, yeah, my, my new team this morning was awesome and just saying, hey, yeah, cool, everything's going well, you know, but you're probably going to experience more of the discomfort and side effects and whatever in the next couple of days, which is not super fun to hear. But I would much rather hear that and know that than be told otherwise and experience otherwise.
Speaker 1:Yes, and so with this information I got on my phone, I started texting people hey, please pray for Thomas. He's probably going to be in a lot of pain. I kept saying this word pain and my therapist got back to me in a text message and she had said I am praying for you and I'm praying that Thomas has manageable discomfort or something to that effect.
Speaker 2:That reminded you of our podcast. I was like oh, my gosh discomfort I forgot about that.
Speaker 1:I've been saying pain because it's just part of the vernacular in the medical world and so it isn't bad, we're not trying to pain.
Speaker 2:Shame, no pain, I like it. Yeah, you like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no pain shame. Just, it's a new take.
Speaker 1:It's a kind of an important shift in thinking about what's going on in your body, because when you say I'm in pain, your brain hears the word pain and it responds there's that psychoneuroimmunology is a concept that we'll get to that you'll hear in the episode and so it's something that we can kind of start to make a shift and start saying discomfort instead of pain. So, without further ado, we are going to transition and play this episode for you. Also, I want to make a note. In the show notes of this episode, you will find a link to a website that has a poster that we made back in 2021 that has all of these resources as kind of the tips there. Like, here's the five things you can do, and I'm actually going to print a copy and put it up on our hospital room wall, because I have forgotten all of these things up until today Like, oh yeah, we should be doing that.
Speaker 2:So, hopefully.
Speaker 1:You know we're definitely we're doing a refresh for ourselves as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, awesome. We hope you enjoy the episode.
Speaker 1:It's really great, thomas, that we're talking about this and you really are an expert in pain, and I want to ask you a few questions to kind of kick this off as we dive into the research and just kind of build a foundational understanding. And as we were talking about this topic, you gave me a lot of information that I didn't know at all, so I thought it'd be helpful to have you go over that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, in my field of para-anesthesia nursing, we definitely have our share of patients that are having pain and need it addressed, you know, in the short term, sometimes the long term, and so it's great to get to partner with people to do that and find out what their pain goals are. So I feel pretty blessed to get to do what I do.
Speaker 1:So what is para-anesthesia nursing Awesome question.
Speaker 2:In para-anesthesia, nursing, we're concerned with patients that are getting ready to be sedated or are under sedation or coming out of sedation for a procedure, and so we get them ready. We're there while the procedure happens and we're helping them with their pain needs, with their nausea needs. We're there to help our patients stay safe and to do what we can to help them have a nice, smooth recovery where they can go home.
Speaker 1:Now, pain is a big component of your job and what your patients experience. Can you just kind of tell us what pain is and is it bad? Because I feel like a lot of people, and myself included, when we hear the word pain, bad feelings kind of arise or there's some negative connotations with that. Can you tell us more about pain?
Speaker 2:Yeah, for sure, and I think most people, when they think of pain, it's immediately a negative association which you know it should be by all means. Physical pain is your body telling you, hey, something's not right here. Whether it's you know you stubbed your toe and shouldn't be putting more weight on it, or you know you broke a leg or what have you, it's your body signaling to you, hey, there's an injury here, be careful. You know, if we didn't feel pain, you know we would probably die off at a very young age because we just wouldn't know the limits of our body. So it's adaptive, basically, until it's maladaptive.
Speaker 2:You know there's pain. That, you know, lets you know about injuries in an acute form. But then if you're experiencing chronic pain or you're having, you know, nerves firing off action potentials, constantly telling your brain that you're feeling this discomfort, but there is nothing really there that can happen as well, then on the other side of the spectrum, there's actually a super rare condition called congenital analgesia, which is actually when someone can't feel pain and never have felt pain, and they have to be super careful because they could break their leg playing soccer and have no idea, or be having appendicitis, you know, and get an infection in their peritoneal cavity and get septic, you know, but not feel the pain, and so feeling pain is actually a good thing, you know. We need to know. It's there so that we know how to protect ourselves.
Speaker 1:When you told me that for the first time, I was mind blown by that, because I can't remember exactly what it was, but I was experiencing discomfort in my body and you just said you know, there are some individuals who don't experience that form of discomfort, and that actually poses challenges of its own.
Speaker 1:And so when you told me that I was able to kind of think differently, like have you made about how people respond to pain in the clinical setting that you work in? Because I know that my perception of pain has certainly changed as I have been with you. So I'm curious what do you see in your patients?
Speaker 2:So some people just kind of accept it as like, okay, this is uncomfortable, but it's not for forever and as part of the healing process, my body's just trying to tell me hey, something's punctured your skin and your abdomen, and it's usually something you'd want to know. Pain is normal, but then, on the other side of the spectrum, some patients wake up and just writhing pain, which is not to downplay either of these experiences or responses to pain. Everyone's different and there shouldn't be any shame in any way conveyed in the different reactions to pain. We're just simply observing them.
Speaker 1:And there are. To ask you a quick question, there are varying levels of like people's pain threshold and tolerance, right, Totally yeah.
Speaker 2:I never judge anyone based on how they wake up from a procedure or how they're feeling before. Everyone's got their own pain threshold and as nurses we have to understand that pain is purely subjective and we have to just take the patient's word for it. There's no other ethical way to go about it. Whatever they say they're feeling, we have to assume that they're feeling and treat it as so.
Speaker 1:As I've heard, you describe just the overall process of working with patients in your setting at a very broad view, not giving any names, but just that general concept. I've learned that you and your staff and other nurses you work with you are so responsive and caring and it makes me feel, it makes me think about the three C's connect, calm, collaborate, like we talked about in season one, where you really are so proficient at connecting with your patients. Hey, I can tell that these things are happening in your body.
Speaker 2:Let's take some breaths or you give them different calming strategies, but basically you're connecting with them and you're validating them in their experience sounds like that hurts, but we're there not just to treat the physical pain but, you know, the whole patient so emotionally, psychologically, to be just a healing presence with them. You know, like anybody can just hand somebody some pills and some water, but you know we're all called to something higher than that, in which we're connecting with the patient. You know you've talked about, you know kids don't care. What you know, totally not that you care. It's the same in the healthcare setting with patients. You know, showing them empathy, compassion, you know, and then just being present with them. You know, like you said, there's other interventions other than pharmacological means to help people treat their pain, like breathing and meditation type mindfulness exercises. You know we implement all those things when someone's having a really hard time Because, as we'll talk about here in a bit, your thoughts and your mindset have such a huge effect on what you're feeling and going through.
Speaker 1:A couple of ways that I saw in the research about the way that we process pain really falls into that fixed versus growth mindset.
Speaker 1:And one way Thomas and I were talking about this prior to the podcast and we coined it type one pain processing. And this is more of that fixed mindset thinking my pain is so overwhelming and I'm going to feel like this forever or maybe even more short-term just ow, ow, I'm in pain, just really focused on the now and then. Type two pain processing sounds different. It sounds more along the lines of a growth mindset. You're understanding that you are experiencing discomfort, but you also know that there are things you can do to feel better and that this discomfort you're experiencing is temporary and that things will get better. And the reason why it's important to understand both of the types is because when you're able to adopt more of that growth mindset, that holistic understanding that you have agency and autonomy through healing in your journey, that is helpful for the way that people behave and how seriously they take their follow-up discharge instructions, which might include doing physical therapy, getting up and taking walks using an incentive spirometer, which Thomas can explain to you. It's a very fancy term.
Speaker 2:No, you got it right. It just basically helps you expand your lungs back out, makes your little alveoli pop open in your lungs so that it's less likely that you get pneumonia.
Speaker 1:So these are all important things that patients can do after a surgery. And when someone is more in the mindset of there's something I can do, I have agency I'm ready to heal. That is much more conducive for successful healing after a surgery.
Speaker 2:Definitely.
Speaker 1:And another thing that I came across in the research is how our perceptions affect us at a cognitive level, and this can actually affect not only the way our brains are working, but also our immune system. What do they call this in the medical research?
Speaker 2:All right, so get ready for this. It's psychoneuroimmunology. And yes, it's all one word. If you got that in Scrabble, it's like instant win forever for all time.
Speaker 1:Note taken.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the study of your psyche and how that affects your central nervous system and how your central nervous system in turn affects your immune system and so your body getting flooded with, you know, stress hormones like cortisol. It's not awesome for healing, it's going to prolong healing. You know epinephrine in your bloodstream, or adrenaline you know it constricts blood vessels, so you're not getting the greatest blood flow to the areas you need it. So being in fight, flight or freeze while you're trying to heal is not the best.
Speaker 1:Not optimal.
Speaker 2:Not optimal yeah.
Speaker 1:I think that I am ready to bring this to a personal level, and this is specifically relates to a surgery, a couple surgeries I had within the last year and I went through this process of reinterpreting pain and from this point forward I'm actually not going to say pain, but instead I'm going to use the word discomfort Because before my first surgery and shout out to the doctors at OHSU in Oregon the doctors there are incredible and before my first surgery, the scheduling nurse said okay, we're going to get you set up with a different appointment. And I said well, I've already had my pre-op appointments. And she said we're going to actually set you up with a psychologist. At OHSU we recommend that patients see a psychologist beforehand. That way they're mentally prepared to deal with the pain.
Speaker 2:That's so cool.
Speaker 1:It's amazing and it's funny because at that point in time I didn't understand psychoneuroimmunology.
Speaker 2:And you're like I'm totally sane.
Speaker 1:I said, oh, that's nice, I'm actually really busy and I don't think I need that. I fully comprehend what this surgery entails. And they're like, oh, that's cute, go ahead, just have the intro.
Speaker 2:Sure kid yeah.
Speaker 1:So young, so full of hope, and so I was able to learn more. And one of the things I learned it was extremely valuable to get myself mentally prepared for the healing process. One of the things I learned is to not call it pain, but instead say discomfort. Oftentimes we say or I know what I used to say is I'm in pain. Oh my gosh, like I broke my toe right before our wedding and I thought that I might have to literally have like a cast or a boot.
Speaker 2:Hobble down the aisle. Hobble down the aisle White cast to match the dress.
Speaker 1:I could have put like blue something borrowed something blue on it maybe.
Speaker 2:People could have signed your cast instead of our guest book opportunity missed there. Yeah Well, next time, I guess.
Speaker 1:When we renew our vows.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:I'll break another toe.
Speaker 2:Pinky promise, pinky toe promise. Maybe I'll do it this time.
Speaker 1:Oh, that actually would be nice.
Speaker 2:Yeah, even Steven.
Speaker 1:Division of labor.
Speaker 2:Take one for the team.
Speaker 1:Yeah. But all that to say? At the time I was saying, oh my gosh, I'm in pain. I'm in pain. And what I learned from the psychology aspect that I went through in preparation for my surgery is that when you say pain, your brain hears that and has that negative response. Oh my gosh, you know. Almost like that fight, flight or freeze, there's a bear chasing me and there's pain. Oh no, that's bad. But when we say something like I'm experiencing discomfort, it's almost like the brain is hearing the word comfort, which is much better than hearing the word pain. And also another thing to really be mindful of in our vernacular is saying experiencing rather than in. When you say in pain, it's this all-encompassing state of being in which you are all-encompassed with this. But when you say experiencing this is something I'm currently experiencing, it almost gives this insinuation of this being a transient experience. It's, you know it's currently happening, but there's a timeline.
Speaker 1:There's a timeline I will get better and I'm going to move through this and it's helping us reframe that. So I mean that's we'll start. Should we start doing the tips? Yeah, yeah, and it's helping us reframe that, so I mean that's we'll start should we start doing the tips. Yeah, make it practical.
Speaker 2:We got some awesome tips that Linz was able to get from that psychologist she talked with and they're super, super helpful. I mean, I've used them in the last year when I've had an injury or two.
Speaker 1:When you've experienced discomfort.
Speaker 2:When I've experienced discomfort. Nice and we actually, as nurses, are supposed to use that vernacular as well.
Speaker 1:You're supposed to use discomfort or pain? Yeah, use comfort Really, yeah.
Speaker 2:Because, again, if we say, are you experiencing pain, people are like pain, yes, pain, I'm having pain, oh, no pain. And then they feel like in pain and it's hard to kind of get them to progress, you know, as opposed to using the word discomfort.
Speaker 1:That's really. I didn't know that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're supposed to use that vernacular. We're still getting used to it, since it's kind of a recent change in standard operating procedures.
Speaker 1:but it's a. It's a really neat mindset.
Speaker 2:Definitely.
Speaker 1:So the first thing, that our first tip, is to rebrand the idea of pain, aka discomfort. So, rather than let's, my body is betraying me. Some people have a really negative or not ideal relationship with their body, especially those who experience chronic pain, discomfort I'm correcting myself.
Speaker 2:Yes, it's hard.
Speaker 1:Yes, it can feel like we're thinking come on, work with me. You know, my body's supposed to be maybe healing at a faster timeline, or it's just, just like we mentioned before, kind of all encompassing. So, rather than saying my body betrayed me or I'm Be too brutal, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:Rather than saying I'm in pain or my body's betraying me, my body's my enemy. That's some things that come up in the psychological research surrounding this topic. We can say things like, as we mentioned, I'm experiencing discomfort. And the second thing is my body is talking to me. Hey, body, you can have this little back and forth dialogue, kind of like when we talked about self-compassion, and you use this vernacular where you're kind of talking to yourself and you're giving yourself like a pep talk. And actually in the research it shows that when you give yourself these little pep talks or use self-compassion in that way, it does make a difference.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it's. You know talking to yourself in the same way that you would talk to a loved one.
Speaker 1:Exactly.
Speaker 2:Experiencing that same pain. I think so many of us are so much harder on ourselves. I think it's almost universal that we are our own worst critic, and so reframing and rethinking and talking to your body and everything it's going through as if it's a loved one is really beneficial, they found.
Speaker 1:Exactly. So you're saying this discomfort is actually communication. So you can say hey, body, what are you telling me? What's going on? Because this is important.
Speaker 2:Oh, it hurts to breathe, all right, all right, thanks for letting me know.
Speaker 1:Let's call the doctor and tell our doctor these symptoms. So tip one is to rebrand the idea of pain, say discomfort, and remember that your body's talking to you. Tip number two is to breathe.
Speaker 2:If anyone knows their stuff about breathing, it's definitely you. You have it in the curriculum. You teach kids how to do certain breaths. They call you the breath queen on the streets. Yes, that's what I've been hearing.
Speaker 1:I'm commonly referred to as that, but we do have a YouTube video that has a variety of calming breaths, and this is for kids. So this podcast is more for adults and providing you information. But if you go on YouTube and you search positive choices positive is spelled P-A-W-S-I-T-I-V-E because of the animal characters that have paws we have some videos, some really neat videos for kids that talk about ways to breathe, so we'll link that in the show notes. Tip number three is to practice self-compassion, and we talked about this earlier, but just to reiterate, when you practice self-compassion towards your body, that has an amazing effect on healing.
Speaker 1:So you could tell yourself feeling afraid or anxious or upset is normal. When someone's experiencing discomfort, you're telling yourself I know, this feels scary, but I'm right here for you. You're telling your body that we can do this and this is normal. It's okay to feel this way. Tip number four is to remind your brain that these feelings, this experience of discomfort, is temporary. You can tell your brain that this is a short-term experience and that you can do this, you can move through this and this is something that your body is capable of handling. And the last tip, tip number five is to distract your brain from the discomfort. So for me, because my first surgery was an eight-week healing process and I couldn't really move around much, I was limited in what I could do to distract myself. So I actually had the perfect excuse to binge watch Netflix. I think it was a Netflix series.
Speaker 2:I think it still is on Netflix. Yeah.
Speaker 1:It's called when Calls the Heart. How many seasons are there, do you?
Speaker 2:remember, I don't Too many.
Speaker 1:Maybe eight too many. I think there's eight seasons, eight seasons, seasons, so that just goes to show you how much distracting my brain needed. But this really is an effective thing to do to help yourself redirect that, the emotional toll that discomfort can have on your psychological state of being.
Speaker 2:That's not to say the denial is a path that you want to go down either. I think there's a fine line between distracting yourself and redirecting versus denial, which is you know you're in crippling pain, but you're just telling yourself I have no pain. You know, there's a lot of people that got injured, that should have come in and gotten procedures way earlier, you know, and now it's a lot worse.
Speaker 1:Because they were distracting themselves preemptively Exactly yeah, like oh.
Speaker 2:I went inside and cracked a beer and watched Cops until 11 pm and when I woke up that's when I decided to go to the ER. You know, it's like you should have gone last night.
Speaker 1:So this tip of redirecting your brain's thought process.
Speaker 2:This is after you've received the medical attention that you needed. Right, Right, right. Yeah, just saying there's obviously boundaries on everything. So yeah, there's a difference between distraction and denial.
Speaker 1:Exactly, and all these tips we just listed. These are things that obviously, as adults, it's helpful for us to do for our own healing journey and for our own psychoneuroimmunology, but this is also helpful for our children and students, and so here's kind of what it can sound like if you're coaching a child through discomfort, whether it's physical or emotional. Here's how the tips can sound. So, let's say, your child falls off their bike and hurts their knee and they're bleeding and you know that you need to get your child to the doctor. Here's how you could coach them as they're experiencing this. You could actually start with breathing, and that's tip number two, so you can reverse the order from tip one of rebranding, and then we said tip two was breathing. But if you just reverse those, sometimes that's what's needed because the child needs to pause and calm their nervous system down. So taking those breaths might be the most helpful thing before you dive into talking about rebranding the idea of pain, which would definitely sound different. It might sound something more to the effect of your body's talking to you, your brain, or your body's telling your brain that your knee hurts, and so now we're going to do something to help you feel better While you're in route to the doctor or as you're putting on a bandaid, taking that next step to help the physical discomfort, you could say something to the effect of it's normal to feel upset. If you can see that your child's visibly upset, if you have looked at the Choices curriculum or if you've listened to a previous episode about calming, we have something called a glitter brain frame and that's just a tool that helps kids understand that sometimes their brains can feel mixed up. All the stress hormones, the cortisol, the different parts of their brain that get affected by stress, it can make it hard for them to focus, and so you could say it's okay to feel mixed up, that is normal, I'm right here for you and we're going to do something to help you. So that's what it could sound like to implement.
Speaker 1:Tip three, which is to practice self-compassion. And then tip four is to remind your brain that this is temporary, so you could tell a child you know what. This is temporary. I know that your brain is feeling like this hurts, but it's not going to last forever and you can do this. We're going to move through this together. And then, finally, tip five was to distract your brain from the pain and again you're helping your child by saying let's do something now to give your brain something else to focus on. I know that your knee doesn't feel well now, but let's do something now to give your brain something else to focus on. I know that your knee doesn't feel well now, but let's get off the Legos or let's turn on Paw Patrol, whatever it is, or let's watch Zabuma Fu. Is that even a thing? Is that still?
Speaker 2:Throwback Thursday man, I know it's Tuesday today, but nice.
Speaker 1:I forgot about.
Speaker 2:Zabuma Fu, was that the lemur?
Speaker 1:Yes, I think so, and there was the messy closet which totally looks like a closet in our house.
Speaker 2:Foreshadowing of my life.
Speaker 1:I always thought what a slob watching that.
Speaker 2:I get it, man, I get it.
Speaker 1:I don't know if Zibumafu is still airing, but some kind of family card game, playing Legos, doing something to kind of get their mind distracted. So those are the tips that we've talked about, for adults and also for children alike. I'd like to note that that last tip, tip five, about distracting or redirecting their attention that is helpful. However, it is critical that you begin by connecting with them and not skip over the step of helping them understand that, oh, you fell, your knee hurts, and telling them that it's normal to feel sad or upset, and allowing them to process that something happened. So I think that's really critical, that we keep in mind the importance of helping children process what's happening, making sense of their experience and the research. This is called forming a cohesive narrative. So just be sure to fully acknowledge what's happened before you do the redirecting and refocusing of attention. As we wrap up this episode, we want to give a couple shout outs.
Speaker 2:And I want to give a huge shout out to my fellow Ben's Surgery Center staff. You may never hear this, but if you do, just know that you are awesome. Also, I want to give a shout out to my buddies over in Redmond. Thanks for listening, guys, and we'll see you Thursday for pizza. And that goes to my buddies in Redmond, not the rest of you, I'm sorry.
Speaker 1:Maybe we'll do a meet and greet pizza event sometime after COVID resolves, if that ever happens.
Speaker 2:And then all six of our listeners could come and meet us.
Speaker 1:Yes, and like four of them, are family members.
Speaker 2:Yeah right, one of them's me.
Speaker 1:I have to confess and the other one's me.
Speaker 2:So we're all accounted for It'll be a family affair.
Speaker 1:In all seriousness, we do want to thank all of our listeners who tune in from around the world. You are amazing and we appreciate you taking the time out of your busy schedules to tune in. Hope that you have a wonderful week and we will talk with you soon.
Speaker 2:Take care.
